NEW DELHI: Afghan President Dr Ashraf Ghani delivered one of his most scathing speeches at the Heart of Asia conference in Amritsar on Sunday, alleging that without support from Pakistan, the Taliban wouldn’t survive beyond a month.
In an exclusive interview with The Hindu’s Suhasini Haidar, Ghani spoke of his “frustration” with Pakistan, friendship with India and hopes for the region.
Ghani said he engaged Pakistan, went there and met the civilian and military leadership. “I even went to the GHQ, because each country has its own distinct place for institutions. My message was that there was a window. It could be broadened to a door or a corridor, or it could shut.
"We did everything to ensure peace with Pakistan. 2015 and 2016 have been extremely difficult years and violence that has been inflicted on our people needs to be registered. "To be quiet when people are dying is not acceptable. I am an elected political leader; I need to reflect my people’s sentiment. Because the question of terrorism is not just a threat to us, but also to Pakistan and the Asian region, and hence need Asian region, and hence need for a public statement.”
Asked if the window of opportunity had closed, he said: “They need to open it. We opened the window, now it’s closed, so it’s their turn to open it. Asked what were his hopes from the process now; Ashraf Ghani said: “My speech was in four ‘acts’. The first was our celebration of relationship with India. The second, a celebration of new consensus on Afghanistan from the global community. The third act was the prospect of Asian economic integration. And the fourth was about what we will be deprived of if we don’t do it.
Terrorism is depriving us of this and we need enduring solutions at the Heart of Asia. It is becoming a meaningful process. Our goal would be to link China on one hand to Iran on the other, and also to India. South Asia is the least integrated area and has immense potential.
The worry here would be that it would also be one step from connecting to the China Pakistan Economic Corridor as well, given the rail line from Yiwu to Mazar now. One corridor is not against another. The logic of price will prevail. Afghanistan is so much easier to go through.
Northern Afghanistan is flat. Eventually railway connectivity is to everyone’s benefit, and we shouldn’t see it as a zero sum game.” Asked if the boycott of Saarc conference by India and Afghanistan was meant to isolate Pakistan, Ghani said: “We don’t intend to isolate Pakistan, but when we are under attack, we need to remind that it will not be tolerated.
Engagement is essential, but only engagement that is meaningful. Last year, I went to the Heart of Asia in Islamabad and I was repeatedly assured of a changed policy. Instead we got the worst year of conflict in the last 15 years.
An isolated Pakistan is not in the region’s interest, but Pakistan’s leadership must take action beyond its verbal assurances.” When reminded that in an interview with The Hindu in May 2015, he said ‘if Pakistan continued to block transit trade with India, Afghanistan will block its access to Central Asia’ and asked if it was still a threat, Ghani said: “We actually went through with it. Trade between Afghanistan and Pakistan has been much reduced.
Economically, Afghanistan has become part of Central Asia. The opening to the port in Turkmenistan fundamentally changes our dependence on the route through Pakistan. It’s five times cheaper and reliable. This image or idea that we are dependent on the port of Karachi must be removed. Afghanistan is at the Heart of Asia, and a heart has many valves. We are de-blocking those valves at present.
To a question, he said India was converging with Afghanistan and there was nothing secret. “It is a transparent state to state relationship. We are driven by common goals and opportunities.
When the interviewer told Ghani that the relationship was not always as good when he began his tenure, he contested: “They were, but some commentators only saw a zero sum game. Afghanistan wants to become a centre of cooperation. PM Modi and I have had a meeting of minds from the moment we met, and that has resulted in this convergence.”
Asked how the new air cargo agreement between India and Afghanistan will change the situation given that they already had many flights between them, Ghani said: “We are essentially reviving the old caravan route….in the sky, when we look for high value, low volume trade. Instead of seeing our trade over land being blocked, this corridor gives us predictability on goods like medicines.
India produces cheaper medicines than anywhere. Having an organized process will do wonders for our trade. Afghanistan has a name brand in India. From Babur who brought fruit to India to Tagore’s Kabuliwala, there runs a straight line.
Asked if there was room for more than bilateral trade through the Chabahar port now as Gwadar was already seeing Chinese goods go through from the CPEC, he said: ‘What we need to look at is not just Chabahar alone. Iran has 11 neighbours that it is connected to; neighbours like Turkmenistan and Azerbaijan. The issue is Indian trade to Central Asia through Afghanistan, and that makes a lot of sense.”
Asked how he assessed the US’s role in Afghanistan under him under President-elect Trump, the Afghan president said President Obama had made a historic decision to keep a medium term outlook of four years on security for Afghanistan, and President Trump will most likely keep that.
“2015 was ‘our year of survival, 2016 was the year of our organized defence, 2017 and on will be years of success and consolidation. Look, in 2014 there were 140,000 foreign troops in Afghanistan; now there are 10,000 and mostly in supporting roles. Afghan security forces have really come a long way. And now we have an air force.
To a question, he said: “We welcomed the helicopters India sent. Our fleet of helicopters were mostly Russian, and India’s help has been invaluable in helping us maintain them. We will now purchase US equipment. India’s delivery has been a life saver.”
Answering a question about talks with the Taliban, Ghani said: “We had signed a peace agreement with the Hizb-e-Islami this year, so it’s important to know that an intra-Afghanistan dialogue can work.
We can only hope the Taliban will follow the same process. Taliban has just made a pronouncement that it won't attack infrastructure here, that’s because they realize it is very unpopular to do so. The Taliban used to say, the West had watches, but they had the time, and so would win.
The Afghan public is turning against such destructiveness. Also, there is the emergence of other actors like Daesh/IS who could upstage them. So we hope they will realize the need to come to the table.”
Asked how much does the Afghan government really control as the Taliban still appeared to control large areas and even hanged an engineer in public this week, he said: “Around 66-68 per cent is controlled by our forces, about 10 per cent with the Taliban and the rest is contested. There has been a stalemate, but that is now turning in favour of the government. The territory may not have changed, but we are now maintaining our positions instead of the 140,000 foreign troops. The unity of the Afghan Army has been significant in this.”
Asked if Pakistan was out of the peace process, he said: “The Taliban are a red herring in discussions with Pakistan because they need to own up to the threat of terror.” When told that Pakistan often says that it houses millions of Afghan refugees and can’t tell which the Taliban were, Ghani said it was an old excuse.
“One of our corps commanders from Helmand went to Quetta and offered to show the commander there the very houses where Taliban leadership lives. There was silence in reply. The Afghan refugees believe their future is in Afghanistan….if they want to send them back we will take them, even if we have only one loaf of bread to share. I don’t need foreign aid; I need peace to build our country. The world has been re-convinced that Afghanistan is an investment that will yield.
